[yokai]

While stating that, I hope you do not think it's wrong charging for anything, regardless of how small a project/task could be.

I believe that something shouldn't be charged for, as there wouldn't be a reason to charge for it. There is only one simple truth behind charging for every little thing, greed.

[Redsin]

I believe that something shouldn't be charged for, as there wouldn't be a reason to charge for it. There is only one simple truth behind charging for every little thing, greed.

I would say an awards pack is something completely reasonable to charge for. People tend to think about the duration of the task. "Did I really pay $50 for something that he did so fast?" is what people usually thinks, hence why myself and others tend to dry out the time for a period so they think it's worth it in the end. A task can be done good - fast and slow.

Interesting opinions in this site, I might stick around for more discussions like these.

[Theós]

While stating that, I hope you do not think it's wrong charging for anything, regardless of how small a project/task could be.

I believe that something shouldn't be charged for, as there wouldn't be a reason to charge for it. There is only one simple truth behind charging for every little thing, greed.

Actually, some people charge for stuff because they have a life, bills, limited time, and actual job etc. You have such a philosophical veiw you forget to add the real world into consideration lol

[Jebusfathead]

There's being honest and just being disrespectful. If this is something you and BB do that's absolutely fine but from an outsiders perspective you look disrespectful.

"Disrespectful" states that I have showed a lack of respect. Which I haven't. I've stated my opinion and given alternatives to fix them, that is call constructive feedback. I've also stated something that was and/or is a fact currently. If that is disrespectful, then I have no faith in humanity anymore.

From my point of view he's disrespectful and cant take criticism himself however wants to criticize everyone else's work.

But I can take criticism? I am just not interested in nagging just for the sake of it. Hence why when people leave me a comment saying; "This is bad." and nothing else I respond with asking them to actually give a reason. If someone states something like; "This could need some drop shadow." while it already has drop shadow then I will reply stating that the tip is wrong and/or un-needed as by definition it is. (Seeing how it already is there.) If either of those imply that I cannot take criticism then again, I've lost faith in humanity.

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Posts like this is why we need a like button. And like Para said, if someone new saw this i'm 87% sure they'd think it was just rude disrespectful hate rather than the current term imma use of 'banter'

That is because people the past 5 years have gotten so soft, picky and defensive. Compared to your average graphical artist, critic or designer I am fairly mild in my responses. A real critic won't hold back or soften the blow, they'll hit you in the face with a brick and drive over you with a truck. The reason they do that isn't do be disrespectful for fun or to hate on the person they give it to. Its because honesty is the most efficient way to improve. If you know what you did wrong, then you have a far better chance to improve. If someone doesn't tell you what wrong, then how do you improve? Guess? Right, that is going take a few decades.

But if you run over people with a truck over and over, they'll just end up not bothering, then you'll just end up with graphic designers who charge so much money and who are absolutely rude and disrespectful and people won't even bother hiring them, cause if anyone spoke to me worse then what I see on here then I'd tell them to shove their graphics up their arse and hope it pays the bills. Some criticism is fine, but when people start criticising other people's base ideal on which they base their work, that's just stupid, it's like saying 'Here draw a circle, no your circle is wrong it's not circley enough' Like, if they want to do something and others think it is good, what right does anyone have to shit all over their work, sure they can criticise it, but shitting on something and calling it criticism is not the right term for it.

[yokai]

I would say an awards pack is something completely reasonable to charge for. People tend to think about the duration of the task. "Did I really pay $50 for something that he did so fast?" is what people usually thinks, hence why myself and others tend to dry out the time for a period so they think it's worth it in the end. A task can be done good - fast and slow.

Not when there is no spirit, ability or time required to create it. Same as its not justified to charge for picking up something someone else dropped. Say someone on the street drops their wallet, and you pick it up for them, does that justify you in charging for it? No, not really. If it has taken time, then sure charge. If it has taken a great deal of ability, then sure. If it has taken spirit that is unique to you, then sure. But if it hasn't taken either, then no.

Actually, some people charge for stuff because they have a life, bills, limited time, and actual job etc. You have such a philosophical veiw you forget to add the real world into consideration lol

I have bills, limited time, a life and have to buy food. Though I have no actual job as I am currently going to school. (Will have a job when that is done though.) That being said, I have no requirement to take charged for taking 10-15 min of my day doing something I enjoy doing. I do take real life into consideration, it simply doesn't justify charging for every little thing you do.

[Theós]

Whaaaat?! You can tell the icon is a crown, gift box and a heart.

That is a gift box? I thought it was nuclear device concealed by a terrorist group. The crown can easily be mistaken for a claw or a claw mark though.

Also what's with you telling people I'm charging?

Skype said so. 'w' That and you have tried to charge for stupidly small things before.. 'w'

Wait wait... Name a few please.... please do....

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I would say an awards pack is something completely reasonable to charge for. People tend to think about the duration of the task. "Did I really pay $50 for something that he did so fast?" is what people usually thinks, hence why myself and others tend to dry out the time for a period so they think it's worth it in the end. A task can be done good - fast and slow.

Not when there is no spirit, ability or time required to create it. Same as its not justified to charge for picking up something someone else dropped. Say someone on the street drops their wallet, and you pick it up for them, does that justify you in charging for it? No, not really. If it has taken time, then sure charge. If it has taken a great deal of ability, then sure. If it has taken spirit that is unique to you, then sure. But if it hasn't taken either, then no.

Actually, some people charge for stuff because they have a life, bills, limited time, and actual job etc. You have such a philosophical veiw you forget to add the real world into consideration lol

I have bills, limited time, a life and have to buy food. Though I have no actual job as I am currently going to school. (Will have a job when that is done though.) That being said, I have no requirement to take charged for taking 10-15 min of my day doing something I enjoy doing. I do take real life into consideration, it simply doesn't justify charging for every little thing you do.

Here's the problem, who are you arguing to? Me? That I charge for every little thing I do?

[Red_mybb_import25644]

I don't see how these are better than @@10 i actually think these are ugly. I don't get why some of them have white lines and the others don't either. If they were buttons they would be on a cheap second hand toy.

[Theós]

And also, I've done so many things for free it's not even funny. And for things like animated sigs, thread designs, logos, I charge waaaay to little. Hell, I even sold a pack of like 6 userbars for like $15. There's nothing wrong with wanting some money for your work.

[yokai]

But if you run over people with a truck over and over, they'll just end up not bothering, then you'll just end up with graphic designers who charge so much money and who are absolutely rude and disrespectful and people won't even bother hiring them, cause if anyone spoke to me worse then what I see on here then I'd tell them to shove their graphics up their arse and hope it pays the bills. Some criticism is fine, but when people start criticising other people's base ideal on which they base their work, that's just stupid, it's like saying 'Here draw a circle, no your circle is wrong it's not circley enough' Like, if they want to do something and others think it is good, what right does anyone have to shit all over their work, sure they can criticise it, but shitting on something and calling it criticism is not the right term for it.

If you become a dick because someone were honest with you, then you'd really need to grow up. Face the reality, that well reality is a cruel and honest place to be. That is why we have constructive feedback, to avoid that scenario. You tell people why something is wrong or bad, and tell them on how to improve on that. (Hopefully without directly telling them, as they'll need to learn how to think for themselves too). For the past years I've been criticized by professionals, critics and randoms on a daily basis. The thing I learned is this;

Random people are too kind and un-knowledgeable/un-experienced to give any feedback that is remotely helpful most of the time. However they can be useful to see things from a different view.

Critics are downright honest, and while it hurts like a truck at times, it is the most efficient way to improve. The reason is that they are being honest in the most graphic way to make sure you understood them in every possible way. They often have experience and knowledge to share as well, along with offering an alternative view.

Professionals are a mixed bag, as some are terrible at criticism as they tend to be too afraid that people will look down at them afterwards, that or they are all high and mighty, which just means they'll give shallow reasons for their comments and/or no reason at all. Though as I said, they could be a mixed bag and fill the same role as a critic.

In design, ideal plays a big role in the work. You should be able to explain what your thought was, how you used that thought to make the final product and so on. Furthermore, unlike art, in design the person at the other end (the one getting it) has to understand your ideal. If you fail to do that, then your design has failed to do its job. (This is the reason most people instantly see red as a "bad color" or a "warning". It is also the reason why we don't question that a "X" means close for example. Its become an understandable trait.)

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I don't see how these are better than @@10 i actually think these are ugly. I don't get why some of them have white lines and the others don't either. If they were buttons they would be on a cheap second hand toy.

There isn't a single pixel of pure white on either of these. They all have the same highlights.

And also, I've done so many things for free it's not even funny. And for things like animated sigs, thread designs, logos, I charge waaaay to little. Hell, I even sold a pack of like 6 userbars for like $15. There's nothing wrong with wanting some money for your work.

15$ is a fitting price for 6 userbars, nowhere is that "far too little". On an international level, its a fair price for the work. I never said it was anything wrong with charging, as long as it is justified. 20 seconds of work that require no skill or soul put into it isn't justified.

[Jebusfathead]

But if you run over people with a truck over and over, they'll just end up not bothering, then you'll just end up with graphic designers who charge so much money and who are absolutely rude and disrespectful and people won't even bother hiring them, cause if anyone spoke to me worse then what I see on here then I'd tell them to shove their graphics up their arse and hope it pays the bills. Some criticism is fine, but when people start criticising other people's base ideal on which they base their work, that's just stupid, it's like saying 'Here draw a circle, no your circle is wrong it's not circley enough' Like, if they want to do something and others think it is good, what right does anyone have to shit all over their work, sure they can criticise it, but shitting on something and calling it criticism is not the right term for it.

If you become a dick because someone were honest with you, then you'd really need to grow up. Face the reality, that well reality is a cruel and honest place to be. That is why we have constructive feedback, to avoid that scenario. You tell people why something is wrong or bad, and tell them on how to improve on that. (Hopefully without directly telling them, as they'll need to learn how to think for themselves too). For the past years I've been criticized by professionals, critics and randoms on a daily basis. The thing I learned is this;

Random people are too kind and un-knowledgeable/un-experienced to give any feedback that is remotely helpful most of the time. However they can be useful to see things from a different view.

Critics are downright honest, and while it hurts like a truck at times, it is the most efficient way to improve. The reason is that they are being honest in the most graphic way to make sure you understood them in every possible way. They often have experience and knowledge to share as well, along with offering an alternative view.

Professionals are a mixed bag, as some are terrible at criticism as they tend to be too afraid that people will look down at them afterwards, that or they are all high and mighty, which just means they'll give shallow reasons for their comments and/or no reason at all. Though as I said, they could be a mixed bag and fill the same role as a critic.

In design, ideal plays a big role in the work. You should be able to explain what your thought was, how you used that thought to make the final product and so on. Furthermore, unlike art, in design the person at the other end (the one getting it) has to understand your ideal. If you fail to do that, then your design has failed to do its job. (This is the reason most people instantly see red as a "bad color" or a "warning". It is also the reason why we don't question that a "X" means close for example. Its become an understandable trait.)

But that still doesn't justify the fact that although sometimes you have to be tough with criticism so people will improve, it doesn't excuse the fact that being a dick all the time not only to people's work, but to their ideas as well is not ok.