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+--- Thread: Life (/Thread-Life--49854)
RE: Life - noize - 06-14-2013
There is no god. Now, people say "How can you say that? You've got no prove! Everyone is free to believe in what he better likes." That's true, I'm not forcing anyone to believe me, and it's no matter to me if you believe in any god, I'm not saying you can't, I'm just saying you're wrong.
There is no god for the simple reason that there couldn't be any. If he was, where? And how on Ear^H^H^Hthis universe could he watch everyone everywhere everywhen everywhy anyhow? He's scientifically speaking got the same chances to be that Santa Clause has, as many books talk about Santa Clause as well.
P.S: I'm not atheist, I am against any form of religion.
RE: Life - xevenofhearts - 06-15-2013
I personally am a Christian but I question it pretty much every day. I won't say too much, but this has been great reading material, even though I barely read the first half of it xD
RE: Life - Linuxephus™ - 06-15-2013
(06-14-2013, 10:41 PM)noize Wrote: There is no god. Now, people say "How can you say that? You've got no prove! Everyone is free to believe in what he better likes." That's true, I'm not forcing anyone to believe me, and it's no matter to me if you believe in any god, I'm not saying you can't, I'm just saying you're wrong.
There is no god for the simple reason that there couldn't be any. If he was, where? And how on Ear^H^H^Hthis universe could he watch everyone everywhere everywhen everywhy anyhow? He's scientifically speaking got the same chances to be that Santa Clause has, as many books talk about Santa Clause as well.
P.S: I'm not atheist, I am against any form of religion.
Incorrect.
Just as any are free to believe the earth also is flat doesn't make it a basis in fact or reality. Nor your synopsis of "there couldn't be for the simple reason that there couldn't be".
God is a proven Creator.
God is proven to exist.
God cannot be proven to not exist.
If God does not exist, as per your poorly worded denial, then how does one even know the existence of the subject material to argue an alleged non-existence?
More reading of the entire thread, less time spent making a carelessly boneheaded comment such as that friend.
After all, you nor any living man has yet to successfully Disprove the existence of God on the merit of it being impossible to Disprove.
Unlike Santa Clause.
Please, read the entire thread before further commentation on the subject material because I Know you to be far more intelligent than that due to this very subject matter already being covered before this correction.
And do keep in mind, had you simply and directly stated, "I don't believe in God.", that is entirely different than the comment you left yourself open to so easily being corrected.
RE: Life - Solixious - 06-15-2013
I would like to ask one very important question to ALL the believers who preach about existence of God and the fact that He can save us if we believe in Him and worship him. But before that I would like a state a fact. All the religions on earth have been created out of fear, weakness and incompetence of humans. It has been made by humans, and it will be limited to human minds. One of the reasons it exists is because our human minds have been unable to fathom certain natural phenomenon like our existence. If it exists in human minds, or in books written by humans, it does not prove that it exists in reality.
If you are such a stern believer in God as Almighty, tell me why is it only the humans that believe in existence of God. Why don't tigers, snails, dolphins, etc. ever read ANY so called holy book on earth? If a hyena steals food hunted by tiger, is it a sin? Will s/he go to hell for that if s/he doesn't accept Christ as savior? What happens to other life forms when they die? Is a judgement passed for them too? I don't think so.
Now let me tell you why religion exists. It exists because there were few good humans who feared the capacity of humans to bring harm to themselves. They knew that even though humans were an intelligent being, they were very weak, greedy and lazy. Religion exists so that we don't destroy each other in order to sustain ourselves and value the quality called goodness today.
Cheers
RE: Life - Nailo - 06-15-2013
(06-15-2013, 01:57 AM)Linuxephus™ Wrote:(06-14-2013, 10:41 PM)noize Wrote: There is no god. Now, people say "How can you say that? You've got no prove! Everyone is free to believe in what he better likes." That's true, I'm not forcing anyone to believe me, and it's no matter to me if you believe in any god, I'm not saying you can't, I'm just saying you're wrong.
There is no god for the simple reason that there couldn't be any. If he was, where? And how on Ear^H^H^Hthis universe could he watch everyone everywhere everywhen everywhy anyhow? He's scientifically speaking got the same chances to be that Santa Clause has, as many books talk about Santa Clause as well.
P.S: I'm not atheist, I am against any form of religion.
Incorrect.
Just as any are free to believe the earth also is flat doesn't make it a basis in fact or reality. Nor your synopsis of "there couldn't be for the simple reason that there couldn't be".
God is a proven Creator.
God is proven to exist.
God cannot be proven to not exist.
If God does not exist, as per your poorly worded denial, then how does one even know the existence of the subject material to argue an alleged non-existence?
More reading of the entire thread, less time spent making a carelessly boneheaded comment such as that friend.
After all, you nor any living man has yet to successfully Disprove the existence of God on the merit of it being impossible to Disprove.
Unlike Santa Clause.
Please, read the entire thread before further commentation on the subject material because I Know you to be far more intelligent than that due to this very subject matter already being covered before this correction.
And do keep in mind, had you simply and directly stated, "I don't believe in God.", that is entirely different than the comment you left yourself open to so easily being corrected.
1)I don't think the burden of proof issue should be this difficult. If your god is true, then show us something real. Otherwise, just admit that it is a matter of faith and does not have any basis in reality.
3)Can you prove that the Invisible Pink Unicorn does not exist? You Can't Prove a Negative
RE: Life - noize - 06-15-2013
(06-15-2013, 01:57 AM)Linuxephus™ Wrote:(06-14-2013, 10:41 PM)noize Wrote: There is no god. Now, people say "How can you say that? You've got no prove! Everyone is free to believe in what he better likes." That's true, I'm not forcing anyone to believe me, and it's no matter to me if you believe in any god, I'm not saying you can't, I'm just saying you're wrong.
There is no god for the simple reason that there couldn't be any. If he was, where? And how on Ear^H^H^Hthis universe could he watch everyone everywhere everywhen everywhy anyhow? He's scientifically speaking got the same chances to be that Santa Clause has, as many books talk about Santa Clause as well.
P.S: I'm not atheist, I am against any form of religion.
Incorrect.
Just as any are free to believe the earth also is flat doesn't make it a basis in fact or reality. Nor your synopsis of "there couldn't be for the simple reason that there couldn't be".
God is a proven Creator.
God is proven to exist.
God cannot be proven to not exist.
If God does not exist, as per your poorly worded denial, then how does one even know the existence of the subject material to argue an alleged non-existence?
More reading of the entire thread, less time spent making a carelessly boneheaded comment such as that friend.
After all, you nor any living man has yet to successfully Disprove the existence of God on the merit of it being impossible to Disprove.
Unlike Santa Clause.
Please, read the entire thread before further commentation on the subject material because I Know you to be far more intelligent than that due to this very subject matter already being covered before this correction.
And do keep in mind, had you simply and directly stated, "I don't believe in God.", that is entirely different than the comment you left yourself open to so easily being corrected.
Well, it won't bother me if you're a believer, Linuxephus. I'm just saying that it is impossible for any god to exist. Stephen Hawking said that no one could be before the universe born, and no one could create it, because before the Big-Bang, nothing were, nor the concept of time. In some environment like this, nothing could even be. Nothing and no one existed before the "creation". Some, maybe better argumented argumentation:
(06-15-2013, 03:42 AM)Solixious Wrote: I would like to ask one very important question to ALL the believers who preach about existence of God and the fact that He can save us if we believe in Him and worship him. But before that I would like a state a fact. All the religions on earth have been created out of fear, weakness and incompetence of humans. It has been made by humans, and it will be limited to human minds. One of the reasons it exists is because our human minds have been unable to fathom certain natural phenomenon like our existence. If it exists in human minds, or in books written by humans, it does not prove that it exists in reality.
If you are such a stern believer in God as Almighty, tell me why is it only the humans that believe in existence of God. Why don't tigers, snails, dolphins, etc. ever read ANY so called holy book on earth? If a hyena steals food hunted by tiger, is it a sin? Will s/he go to hell for that if s/he doesn't accept Christ as savior? What happens to other life forms when they die? Is a judgement passed for them too? I don't think so.
Now let me tell you why religion exists. It exists because there were few good humans who feared the capacity of humans to bring harm to themselves. They knew that even though humans were an intelligent being, they were very weak, greedy and lazy. Religion exists so that we don't destroy each other in order to sustain ourselves and value the quality called goodness today.
Cheers
P.S: I said "There is no god for the simple reason that there couldn't be any" and not "there couldn't be any because there couldn't be any".
Though, I am conscious of it having been a pretty poor-worded throw-up. However, if you take Christianity for instance, it's nothing but conformism: you'll probably agree that you wouldn't be now a christian if nobody teached you to be so. Since the day I was born people told me there's a god who can see everyone everytime. This god had a son, Jesus Christ. Why do I know all these things? Because I born in a christian country. If I born in an islamic country, I'd have believed in the islamic religion, at least till I grew older. Who knows what I'd be now if I born in an islamic religion? There's a theory, the theory of chaos, telling that the smallest change can influence a whole eternity in unpredictable and incredible ways. Though, I can tell that nearly for sure I'd have been an islamic kid at least until I'd have been very young (5/6 years old). Let's say in your country, there was nobody telling you what to believe in, and religion never existed, would you now be a christian? Think about it, 'cause you wouldn't. I'm just saying to re-consider your position, as most believe in what they believe because someone just said "This is true, look at how many believe in it." When I had my first religious doubts I was 8 or 9, and it was weird, I mean, people were all like if you could not believe in something else, like just a society full of robots taught to believe in what is best for the government. I asked to someone "Do you believe in God?", and I got "Of course, you don't?". I think I became really an atheist (I know I said I'm not, but I were) at the age of 10, or maybe 11, and when this kind of arguments came to speaking, they were all like "You don't believe in God? You can't be serious. Are you buddhist?" What? I mean, Buddhism is one of the religions I estimate most, but, I mean, can't I just believe there is no god? I stopped believing as I understood it was ridiculous to believe in what I used to believe in. I am an a-religious since the age of 14.Hope you didn't get offended, my friend, just tried to better explain my poor-worded blahblattor.
RE: Life - Linuxephus™ - 06-15-2013
@Solixious:
{All the religions on earth have been created out of fear, weakness and incompetence of humans. It has been made by humans, and it will be limited to human minds. One of the reasons it exists is because our human minds have been unable to fathom certain natural phenomenon like our existence. If it exists in human minds, or in books written by humans, it does not prove that it exists in reality.}
-->>Agreed.
And this is what Defines the difference between mans concept (religion) of God and what truly defines God (Jesus Christ, his own Son) as factually evidenced and recorded historically.
{If you are such a stern believer in God as Almighty, tell me why is it only the humans that believe in existence of God. Why don't tigers, snails, dolphins, etc. ever read ANY so called holy book on earth? If a hyena steals food hunted by tiger, is it a sin? Will s/he go to hell for that if s/he doesn't accept Christ as savior? What happens to other life forms when they die? Is a judgement passed for them too? I don't think so.}
-->>Because God didn't create the beast of the fields, fowl of the air, and fish of the sea to "believe" since these creatures lack the intellect to even choose what to "believe", let alone the intellect to have the Will to even read.
Your logic is flawed in this regard as such is quite obvious for even asking with no point of validity in so doing.
And no, judgement cannot be passed on that which lacks the capacity consciously make a choice for good or bad.
{Now let me tell you why religion exists. It exists because there were few good humans who feared the capacity of humans to bring harm to themselves. They knew that even though humans were an intelligent being, they were very weak, greedy and lazy. Religion exists so that we don't destroy each other in order to sustain ourselves and value the quality called goodness today.
Cheers
}-->>Again, agreed on the merit of man's concept (religion) of God not being that which defines God.
@"LiveFaster":
{1)I don't think the burden of proof issue should be this difficult. If your god is true, then show us something real. Otherwise, just admit that it is a matter of faith and does not have any basis in reality.}
-->>The burden of proof is not as difficult as many make it out to be by needlessly foolish complications because many, among all are unable to disprove God doesn't exist while evidence of that very existence resides in His Son who is known to have historically existed, with no corpse ever found, eyewitness testimony in the hundreds having witnessed his earthly death, resurrected presence, and ascension. Not counting miracles performed over a 33 year period of life.
Thus, logic dictates ample evidence exists, has existed, and will always exist despite the Chosen lack of understanding many choose to exhibit as a means of justifying their own personal choices in life.
All of which has yet again been reiterated by me in this very thread a number of times using differing words to explain what is readily available for reading in said thread.
And I won't bother touching upon the fact that you, and all, at some point Here have prayed to the very God that is alleged not to exist.
{3)Can you prove that the Invisible Pink Unicorn does not exist? You Can't Prove a Negative}
-->>A negative can be proven or even disproven by the virtue of it being Negative, non-existent, not having substance, known to not exist.
Which is a completely different subject matter versus individual doubt that fails to hold the validity of questioning a given reality.
Doubt, uncertainty, or even denial, chosen, is not a basis for determining reality on the merit of the choice made to do so even with readily available information to obfuscate such choices. Further alluding to faith of what is known to exist lending further credence to that very reality.
@noize:
You of course are free to believe whatsoever you choose brother.
My rebuttal in the entire proceedings is not to make any individual choose against there Will, but merely to keep the facts clear in the avoidance of human nature assuming an individual's chosen beliefs separate from what the facts are to make a long story short.
Hence, I cannot be offended by beliefs that fail to obfuscate the facts for what they are.:lol:
In regards to Hawking; this was answered on page 5 or 6 of this thread.
Not to mention, I'll point you back to reading the pertinent rebuttal to the very comment you've made in those regards along extremely similar lines of thought already made mention of by LiveFaster if I recall correctly.
P.S.-God is not a living, finite entity that is subject to Hawking's brilliant Theory (emphasis on theory...unproven) by way of reasoning when the very Law Of Physics that he uses to make his thesis overlooks with intention the very nature of God not being subject to that which He created.
For every point Hawking presented his theory upon, is another point that obfuscates it not only just as reasonably, but even more so to the point that it creates reasonable doubt for the keen minds that called said theory into doubt (thus, his lack of evidence, despite brilliant reasoning skills on his part that avoids logical deduction) point for point.
RE: Life - Solixious - 06-15-2013
(06-15-2013, 10:28 AM)Linuxephus™ Wrote: {If you are such a stern believer in God as Almighty, tell me why is it only the humans that believe in existence of God. Why don't tigers, snails, dolphins, etc. ever read ANY so called holy book on earth? If a hyena steals food hunted by tiger, is it a sin? Will s/he go to hell for that if s/he doesn't accept Christ as savior? What happens to other life forms when they die? Is a judgement passed for them too? I don't think so.}
-->>Because God didn't create the beast of the fields, fowl of the air, and fish of the sea to "believe" since these creatures lack the intellect to even choose what to "believe", let alone the intellect to have the Will to even read.
Your logic is flawed in this regard as such is quite obvious for even asking with no point of validity in so doing.
And no, judgement cannot be passed on that which lacks the capacity consciously make a choice for good or bad.
So who created them? Don't you think what you said is conclusive in itself that God has partially created the world. What about the others on earth? What happens to them when they die? Don't say they vanish out of existence while it is the only human form of life that has some events to be done even after death.
RE: Life - Linuxephus™ - 06-16-2013
(06-15-2013, 01:45 PM)Solixious Wrote: So who created them? Don't you think what you said is conclusive in itself that God has partially created the world. What about the others on earth? What happens to them when they die? Don't say they vanish out of existence while it is the only human form of life that has some events to be done even after death.
You *Misunderstand* my statement.
Nowhere was it stated by me that "God didn't create them".
It was stated in the context of "God didn't create [them] to be intelligent enough to make choices, read books (seriously?), or to be made in His Image". Nor did I state no such material about "God only having partially created the world" when in fact God is the sole author and source of that domain...on a universal scale.
A total difference than what your misunderstanding elicited.
Re-read it accordingly.
Man and woman, when death comes upon them [us], leaves us in judgement for either Heaven or Hell.
Beasts of the field, fowl of the air, and fish of the sea, not having the capacity to know right from wrong, therefore return spiritually (infer their soul) to God's domain.
Even for those who slaughter a human because the death of the beast's body is the penalty for that, as it is written.
And, I tell you nothing but that the facts for what they are as evidenced and I tell you nothing that isn't first an assumption on your part where I merely label a correction as needed for the purpose of teaching enlightenment.
Whatsoever you do with such is your decision alone, as it is to each individual who ever lived, does live, and will ever live.
Any conversation I'm involved in, is done with the strength of all of my mind, heart, body, and soul, or not at all.
RE: Life - noize - 06-16-2013
(06-16-2013, 04:16 AM)Linuxephus™ Wrote: Beasts of the field, fowl of the air, and fish of the sea
:epic: