(08-04-2016, 03:44 PM)superMAUS Wrote: It's not inherently important to have a successful society but it helps. Arguably every modern breakthrough can be attributed to racial diversity, in the sense that the sharing of ideas and ideals and the way this forces comparison of those ideas and ideals is helpful.

A racially diverse society doesn't necessarily relate at all to any debate regarding positive discrimination I saw mentioned in previous threads.

Frankly though, in order to have the most interesting society, racial diversity (assuming this carries with it cultural diversity)  is beneficial.

EDIT: Having read some of your posts you attempt to differentiate racial diversity and cultural diversity which I think is strange. If we are to imagine a society were races differ but the culture is homogeneous then debate would have to be surrounding genetics, and the pseudosciences accompanying that. In the real world though it is impossible not to talk about the merits of a racially diverse society without mentioning cultural difference. An obvious example: Blacks in America have been around for ages since they were imported from Africa and yet they maintain a clearly defined African-American culture. The merits of a racially diverse society are all based around the benefits of a culturally diverse society.

Quote:Arguably every modern breakthrough can be attributed to racial diversity

(08-04-2016, 03:01 PM)mothered Wrote: Precisely.

Just adding to this (generally speaking), If not for the Italians, you won't have any concrete In your driveway. If not for the Turks, you won't be eating kebabs. If not for the Greeks, they'd be no TV repairs. There's good and bad In everyone, therefore I don't judge people by race.

(08-04-2016, 05:30 PM)meow Wrote: If I'm reading between the lines correctly, what you're saying when you say racial diversity = cultural diversity is that people born to a certain race are automatically forced into a certain culture with no choice to adopt others, which is ridiculous.

(08-04-2016, 05:46 PM)superMAUS Wrote:

(08-04-2016, 05:30 PM)meow Wrote: If I'm reading between the lines correctly, what you're saying when you say racial diversity = cultural diversity is that people born to a certain race are automatically forced into a certain culture with no choice to adopt others, which is ridiculous.

Your not "forced" into a certain culture at birth,  but you have an inherent connection with that culture, this shouldn't even be a point of contention it's just obvious. The idea that you have no links or ties and stop being a part of  the culture you were born into is not the case in the vast majority of cases. The vast majority of people  are attached to their culture from birth, and that;s not at all a ridiculous thing to say.

(08-04-2016, 06:06 PM)meow Wrote:

(08-04-2016, 05:46 PM)superMAUS Wrote:

(08-04-2016, 05:30 PM)meow Wrote: If I'm reading between the lines correctly, what you're saying when you say racial diversity = cultural diversity is that people born to a certain race are automatically forced into a certain culture with no choice to adopt others, which is ridiculous.

Your not "forced" into a certain culture at birth,  but you have an inherent connection with that culture, this shouldn't even be a point of contention it's just obvious. The idea that you have no links or ties and stop being a part of  the culture you were born into is not the case in the vast majority of cases. The vast majority of people  are attached to their culture from birth, and that;s not at all a ridiculous thing to say.

This is where the hole in your logic comes in. You can argue semantics all you want, but race doesn't have to have anything to do with that culture that someone is born into. Let's say an Indian man and woman who have moved to America and adopted American culture have a child, who is also Indian obviously. In America, this would be racial diversity, but not cultural diversity.

Quote: This comes back to the thing I've been saying for 29384 posts now, racial diversity does not equal cultural diversity. One could argue that "most blacks adopt African-american culture, therefore race and culture are inevitably linked", but that would be implying correlation implies causation, which isn't true at all.

Also, you are making the fallacious assumption that because one is born into a culture, one must obviously keep a part of that culture sticking to them, which isn't true. If you think you can prove me wrong then go ahead.

(08-04-2016, 06:23 PM)superMAUS Wrote:

(08-04-2016, 06:06 PM)meow Wrote:

(08-04-2016, 05:46 PM)superMAUS Wrote: Your not "forced" into a certain culture at birth,  but you have an inherent connection with that culture, this shouldn't even be a point of contention it's just obvious. The idea that you have no links or ties and stop being a part of  the culture you were born into is not the case in the vast majority of cases. The vast majority of people  are attached to their culture from birth, and that;s not at all a ridiculous thing to say.

This is where the hole in your logic comes in. You can argue semantics all you want, but race doesn't have to have anything to do with that culture that someone is born into. Let's say an Indian man and woman who have moved to America and adopted American culture have a child, who is also Indian obviously. In America, this would be racial diversity, but not cultural diversity.

I think your kidding yourself if you think this happens in the majority of cases. The idea that the child would be raised without Indian culture in the majority of cases is wacky. Sure the family could adopt American culture but that doesn't mean that that Indian culture is thrown out the window. Do you really think that your example is reflective of the the majority of instances like this?

Quote: This comes back to the thing I've been saying for 29384 posts now, racial diversity does not equal cultural diversity. One could argue that "most blacks adopt African-american culture, therefore race and culture are inevitably linked", but that would be implying correlation implies causation, which isn't true at all.

Also, you are making the fallacious assumption that because one is born into a culture, one must obviously keep a part of that culture sticking to them, which isn't true. If you think you can prove me wrong then go ahead.

Why are you arguing what seems to be, on both sides of politics, counter intuitive. There is obvious correlation between race and culture, how many Caucasians eat samosas with regularity?

Quote:There is obvious correlation between race and culture, how many Caucasians eat samosas with regularity?

(06-27-2016, 05:28 PM)meow Wrote:

(06-27-2016, 04:17 PM)Eclipse Wrote:

(06-27-2016, 01:00 AM)meow Wrote: You can ask for a source and I can provide it or you can keep pretending I'm wrong and making yourself look stupid by posting memes. I win either way so I'll let you pick your poison.

oshit this nigga serious

Go on then, what's your source?

These are statistical sources, mind you (numbers don't lie). If you say "institutional racism" just be prepared for me to tell you to kill yourself.

http://www.iq-tests.eu/iq-test-IQ-correlations-700.html
https://www.insidehighered.com/news/2015/09/03/sat-scores-drop-and-racial-gaps-remain-large
http://www.rense.com/general79/dut.htm
http://www.rense.com/general77/racedif.htm
https://libertarianrealist.blogspot.com/2012/05/iq-distributions.html (yeah I know it's a blog, but just look at the charts)
http://www.jbhe.com/latest/news/1-22-09/satracialgapfigure.gif

If you want to know why Africans will always be on bottom with regards to intellect, I can provide you several scientific sources for that (science doesn't lie either).

---

Oh look, two people voted in the poll without saying why because they're afraid of their opinions being challenged. How great.

(08-03-2016, 09:35 PM)meow Wrote:

(08-03-2016, 09:26 PM)Jiggly Wrote:

(08-03-2016, 09:01 PM)meow Wrote: Lol, what?

You're confusing cultural diversity and racial diversity. Two completely different things.

Too broad a term? It literally means "diversity of race", is it truly too broad to debate or is it just that you're too close-minded to debate it?

This thread was made for the purpose of debating whether racial diversity is a good thing and if it serves any real purpose - this applies to every place/thing which requires and/or wants racial diversity (e.g. the workplace). No need for another thread.

Okay. Name 5.

What are you questioning about the first statement?
I know the difference between the two. However, they are often interlinked and that is one aspect that I had in mind.
Of course the "diversity of race" is broad in regards to a debate topic. In what context out of the many globally did you want to debate racial diversity? Do you want to talk about it historically? Do you want to discuss it's effects on the workplace? Or socially? Or in politics? Do you think this affects education in both curriculum and in the social environment of a school? Do you think people place different values on racial diversity depending on the country or region that they live in? No need to answer these - They are just thoughts.

Personally, I feel like I could talk for days about this. I don't understand where you get "close-minded" from.  I don't really want to debate something when there's so many ways to look at it, it's not as interesting and people usually go off-topic. I am also the type of person who will always try to look at things from both sides.

My personal feelings about racial diversity are driven by my experiences surrounding it in all the different areas I've lived. Most of these experiences have left a positive impact on my life. This, of course, will not be the case for everybody.

What I was trying to say in my post is that I would be more interested in debating a more specific topic. Since you've already made this one, obviously I'm not expecting you to now go make more. I mentioned it as an idea for the next member who wants to post a debate topic. I find that debate threads on this forum can get tedious.

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(08-03-2016, 09:18 PM)God Wrote: Okay. Wasn't sure if this was the kind of thing where both is implied since racial diversity and cultural diversity will sometimes imply the other. I'll be on my way.

I was of a similar mind as they can come hand in hand. But at least we know now that wasn't the goal of this thread.

Quote:What are you questioning about the first statement?

I am questioning it because it is utterly wrong. Nobody is confusing racial diversity with political correctness.

Quote:I know the difference between the two. However, they are often interlinked and that is one aspect that I had in mind.
Of course the "diversity of race" is broad in regards to a debate topic. In what context out of the many globally did you want to debate racial diversity? Do you want to talk about it historically? Do you want to discuss it's effects on the workplace? Or socially? Or in politics? Do you think this affects education in both curriculum and in the social environment of a school? Do you think people place different values on racial diversity depending on the country or region that they live in? No need to answer these - They are just thoughts.

No matter the setting, be it the workplace, politics, schools - racial diversity only means one thing and one thing only. The setting does not change that, how hard is that for you to grasp?

Let me rephrase my statement since you're not seeming to get it - Is variety of skin color "good" anywhere and does it serve any real purpose anywhere? Why or why not?

(08-04-2016, 10:14 PM)Jiggly Wrote:

(08-03-2016, 09:35 PM)meow Wrote:

(08-03-2016, 09:26 PM)Jiggly Wrote: What are you questioning about the first statement?
I know the difference between the two. However, they are often interlinked and that is one aspect that I had in mind.
Of course the "diversity of race" is broad in regards to a debate topic. In what context out of the many globally did you want to debate racial diversity? Do you want to talk about it historically? Do you want to discuss it's effects on the workplace? Or socially? Or in politics? Do you think this affects education in both curriculum and in the social environment of a school? Do you think people place different values on racial diversity depending on the country or region that they live in? No need to answer these - They are just thoughts.

Personally, I feel like I could talk for days about this. I don't understand where you get "close-minded" from.  I don't really want to debate something when there's so many ways to look at it, it's not as interesting and people usually go off-topic. I am also the type of person who will always try to look at things from both sides.

My personal feelings about racial diversity are driven by my experiences surrounding it in all the different areas I've lived. Most of these experiences have left a positive impact on my life. This, of course, will not be the case for everybody.

What I was trying to say in my post is that I would be more interested in debating a more specific topic. Since you've already made this one, obviously I'm not expecting you to now go make more. I mentioned it as an idea for the next member who wants to post a debate topic. I find that debate threads on this forum can get tedious.

---

I was of a similar mind as they can come hand in hand. But at least we know now that wasn't the goal of this thread.

Quote:What are you questioning about the first statement?

I am questioning it because it is utterly wrong. Nobody is confusing racial diversity with political correctness.

Quote:I know the difference between the two. However, they are often interlinked and that is one aspect that I had in mind.
Of course the "diversity of race" is broad in regards to a debate topic. In what context out of the many globally did you want to debate racial diversity? Do you want to talk about it historically? Do you want to discuss it's effects on the workplace? Or socially? Or in politics? Do you think this affects education in both curriculum and in the social environment of a school? Do you think people place different values on racial diversity depending on the country or region that they live in? No need to answer these - They are just thoughts.

No matter the setting, be it the workplace, politics, schools - racial diversity only means one thing and one thing only. The setting does not change that, how hard is that for you to grasp?

Let me rephrase my statement since you're not seeming to get it - Is variety of skin color "good" anywhere and does it serve any real purpose anywhere? Why or why not?

I was actually joking when I said that as there is a common saying "It's political correctness gone mad!" and I was trying to subtley refer to it. It's a failed joke, don't worry about it.

Race implies more than a reference to skin colour alone. It implies origins and nationalities, differences in appearance beyond just skin tone and it implies a whole mix of social and historical thoughts. If you are talking about a skin tone, then there is no good or bad. It's a colour. Skin tone is not = to race. Race is more than that. The word itself has evolved its definition over time.

Rather than have a go at everyone who didn't pick exactly what you meant, skin tone and not any of the other things that a majority of the responses on this thread picked up on, why didn't you simply clarify it early on?

There is no need to belittle people. You're clearly smarter than that.

(08-04-2016, 09:47 PM)Tarew Wrote:

(06-27-2016, 05:28 PM)meow Wrote:

(06-27-2016, 04:17 PM)Eclipse Wrote: oshit this nigga serious

Go on then, what's your source?

These are statistical sources, mind you (numbers don't lie). If you say "institutional racism" just be prepared for me to tell you to kill yourself.

http://www.iq-tests.eu/iq-test-IQ-correlations-700.html
https://www.insidehighered.com/news/2015/09/03/sat-scores-drop-and-racial-gaps-remain-large
http://www.rense.com/general79/dut.htm
http://www.rense.com/general77/racedif.htm
https://libertarianrealist.blogspot.com/2012/05/iq-distributions.html (yeah I know it's a blog, but just look at the charts)
http://www.jbhe.com/latest/news/1-22-09/satracialgapfigure.gif

If you want to know why Africans will always be on bottom with regards to intellect, I can provide you several scientific sources for that (science doesn't lie either).

---

Oh look, two people voted in the poll without saying why because they're afraid of their opinions being challenged. How great.

There are many different factors in this. You could look at the quality of life in the places where these different ethnic groups live (for obvious reasons, your average African American is going to have a lower quality of life compared to a Caucasian person) and also the culture in their different ethnic group (Asian parenting, although a stereotype, is generally very schooling focused compared to every other race). Therefore I wouldn't say that the genetics alone factor into intelligence, although quality of genes passed down do have an effect but that in turn comes back down to how the parents, grandparents etc were raised. Your average Asian has lineage to Monks who very intellectual and had (have?) a decent quality of life, and African Americans have lineage to slaves who were treated very poorly and most of which couldn't even read.

A few sources to studies which looked at the correlation to health/well being and intelligence can be found below. For obvious reasons I don't think sources for the correlation of parenting and intelligence is needed, though if you want I can find credible sources.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3461472/
http://journals.cambridge.org/action/displayAbstract?fromPage=online&aid=897296&fileId=S0007114502000119

(08-04-2016, 10:49 PM)meow Wrote:

(08-04-2016, 10:14 PM)Jiggly Wrote:

(08-03-2016, 09:35 PM)meow Wrote: I am questioning it because it is utterly wrong. Nobody is confusing racial diversity with political correctness.


No matter the setting, be it the workplace, politics, schools - racial diversity only means one thing and one thing only. The setting does not change that, how hard is that for you to grasp?

Let me rephrase my statement since you're not seeming to get it - Is variety of skin color "good" anywhere and does it serve any real purpose anywhere? Why or why not?

I was actually joking when I said that as there is a common saying "It's political correctness gone mad!" and I was trying to subtley refer to it. It's a failed joke, don't worry about it.

Race implies more than a reference to skin colour alone. It implies origins and nationalities, differences in appearance beyond just skin tone and it implies a whole mix of social and historical thoughts. If you are talking about a skin tone, then there is no good or bad. It's a colour. Skin tone is not = to race. Race is more than that. The word itself has evolved its definition over time.

Rather than have a go at everyone who didn't pick exactly what you meant, skin tone and not any of the other things that a majority of the responses on this thread picked up on, why didn't you simply clarify it early on?

There is no need to belittle people. You're clearly smarter than that.

I reworded it incorrectly then, my mistake. Either way, whether I reworded it correctly or not, race and culture are not the same thing. That is not a difficult concept to fathom.

Oh look, two people voted in the poll without saying why because they're afraid of their opinions being challenged. How great.