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+--- Thread: Life (/Thread-Life--49854)
RE: Life - static_cast - 05-24-2013
(05-24-2013, 04:15 PM)chmod Wrote: But at the same time you cannot prove that there IS a god all your theories come from a book written thousands of years ago with no actual proof of who wrote it
First) Maybe you do not realize that science has shown that the bible is the most historically accurate book known. [http://www.apologeticspress.org/APContent.aspx?category=13&article=524]
Second) No one person wrote the Bible, and one person did. Many different people chose the scrolls, but God sew them together. Once the scrolls were written, a large meeting was held as to what scrolls shall be included in the Bible. God chose the scrolls *through* the people. Some people ask, "Is there a hidden book of the Bible that we haven't found?" No. God wouldn't want his people to be led astray.
--
If you believe there are scientific flaws with the Bible, you must realize that the Bible was written from a perspective. For example:
"And the sun stood still, and the moon stopped, until the nation took vengeance on their enemies. Is this not written in the Book of Jashar? The sun stopped in the midst of heaven and did not hurry to set for about a whole day."
That doesn't sound very scientifically accurate does it. Here is the explanation:
http://www.apologeticspress.org/APContent.aspx?category=11&article=1139
RE: Life - chmod - 05-24-2013
Quote: The more I have studied the narrative of the Acts, and the more I have learned year after year about Graeco-Roman society and thoughts and fashions, and organization in those provinces, the more I admire and the better I understand. I set out to look for truth on the borderland where Greece and Asia meet, and found it here [in the Book of Acts—KB]. You may press the words of Luke in a degree beyond any other historian’s, and they stand the keenest scrutiny and the hardest treatment, provided always that the critic knows the subject and does not go beyond the limits of science and of justice (1915, p. 89).
The renowned archaeologist Nelson Glueck put it like this:
It may be stated categorically that no archaeological discovery has ever controverted a Biblical reference. Scores of archaeological findings have been made which conform in clear outline or exact detail historical statements in the Bible (1959, p. 31).
Considering the fact that the land of Palestine in the days of the New Testament writers tossed and turned on a sea of political, economical, and social unrest, I would say that its historical accuracy is pretty amazing. Travel to the Holy Lands and see for yourself if you doubt New Testament accuracy. Carry with you an honest, open mind and a New Testament, and I assure you that you will respect the New Testament writers as accurate historians by the end of your journey.
To me this proves that there was political unrest at the time it was written, this does not however prove the existence of any God/Deity, with all due respect even fictional books have a kernel of truth to them, so this does not convince me otherwise.
The second link you gave was full of speculation and hearsay, a lot of could of been this or might have been that, not as far as I'm concerned proof of anything
RE: Life - static_cast - 05-24-2013
(05-24-2013, 05:45 PM)chmod Wrote:Quote: The more I have studied the narrative of the Acts, and the more I have learned year after year about Graeco-Roman society and thoughts and fashions, and organization in those provinces, the more I admire and the better I understand. I set out to look for truth on the borderland where Greece and Asia meet, and found it here [in the Book of Acts—KB]. You may press the words of Luke in a degree beyond any other historian’s, and they stand the keenest scrutiny and the hardest treatment, provided always that the critic knows the subject and does not go beyond the limits of science and of justice (1915, p. 89).
The renowned archaeologist Nelson Glueck put it like this:
It may be stated categorically that no archaeological discovery has ever controverted a Biblical reference. Scores of archaeological findings have been made which conform in clear outline or exact detail historical statements in the Bible (1959, p. 31).
Considering the fact that the land of Palestine in the days of the New Testament writers tossed and turned on a sea of political, economical, and social unrest, I would say that its historical accuracy is pretty amazing. Travel to the Holy Lands and see for yourself if you doubt New Testament accuracy. Carry with you an honest, open mind and a New Testament, and I assure you that you will respect the New Testament writers as accurate historians by the end of your journey.
To me this proves that there was political unrest at the time it was written, this does not however prove the existence of any God/Deity, with all due respect even fictional books have a kernel of truth to them, so this does not convince me otherwise.
The second link you gave was full of speculation and hearsay, a lot of could of been this or might have been that, not as far as I'm concerned proof of anything
I'm sorry, I cannot guarantee that the sources that I use are completely reliable; I was in a hurry when I posted that.
1) Are you interested in becoming a Christian?
If not, you probably are not going to be open to what I have to say.
2) Are you interested in learning about the Christian faith?
If not, you probably wouldn't have tried to spark this length discussion.
With this, I can safely assume you are interested in learning about the Christian faith, but not interested in becoming a Christian.
I must apologize if we both sound like we're pointer our fingers and saying, "A Ha!". That is not my intention, and neither is it a mature way to have a conversation.
I encourage you to listen to lectures by Ravi Zacharias. He is a very good and unbiased Christian apologist. I believe him to be a greater source of a good understanding of the Christian faith.
"Can Man Live without God?" - Ravi Zacharias [Please Listen]
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xvghod2uv_0&list=PLpN3Dn7l2CGeWhXWY9AgPpkdTtHIn9qE2&index=1
I'm praying for you too!
RE: Life - chmod - 05-24-2013
I do not believe that there is a god, but I respect the beliefs of everyone if I'm wrong I hope one of you will be cool enough to vouch for me come the apocalypse/rapture or whatever, but I do not see enough evidence out there to convince me at this time. I am however fascinated by different cultures and welcome the opportunity to discuss my beliefs (or lack of) with open minded intelligent individuals
RE: Life - Keepalive - 05-24-2013
*Why God is Eternal,
idon't think that it's a proper Question to ask ..
* Why did he even feel the need to create our world in the first place
He says that he Created us to adoring him , and to give us the opportunity to enter heaven..
* If he created everything around us, you can't deny that he even created the evil around us
Yes,For Sure ,He did.. and that As obstacle 4 the Test..
*If God has no equal, why are we, who are his creation, full of defects? Doesn't this fact question our creator's perfection.
He meant to do that..and he will remove those defects in Heaven..
*Why did the best and the most perfect thing created by God betray him eventually and land up being the one we know as devil? What went wrong when God was making him? Why does he even exist? etc.
He was the best gin not an angel ,but because he was so good he got the angels Rank..When god told him to obeisance he Choose to disobey God Cause he says that he is better from us (he made from fire and we made from mud).. and it's not out of God Plan..
*If we believe in stories told to us, we will never get anywhere
if you think it's Just a stories..
Has anyone Saw this Link? http://www.miraclesofthequran.com/scientific_index.html .. And Please if you decided to Have a look ,Make it Deep.
RE: Life - static_cast - 05-25-2013
(05-24-2013, 11:00 PM)Keepalive Wrote: *Why God is Eternal,
idon't think that it's a proper Question to ask ..
* Why did he even feel the need to create our world in the first place
He says that he Created us to adoring him , and to give us the opportunity to enter heaven..
* If he created everything around us, you can't deny that he even created the evil around us
Yes,For Sure ,He did.. and that As obstacle 4 the Test..
*If God has no equal, why are we, who are his creation, full of defects? Doesn't this fact question our creator's perfection.
He meant to do that..and he will remove those defects in Heaven..
*Why did the best and the most perfect thing created by God betray him eventually and land up being the one we know as devil? What went wrong when God was making him? Why does he even exist? etc.
He was the best gin not an angel ,but because he was so good he got the angels Rank..When god told him to obeisance he Choose to disobey God Cause he says that he is better from us (he made from fire and we made from dust).. and it's not out of God Plan..
*If we believe in stories told to us, we will never get anywhere
if you think it's Just a stories..
Has anyone Saw this Link? http://www.miraclesofthequran.com/scientific_index.html .. And Please if you decided to Have a look ,Make it Deep.
Wow. I have never seen so many already-answered questions before.
RE: Life - Solixious - 05-25-2013
(05-24-2013, 11:00 PM)Keepalive Wrote: *Why God is Eternal,
idon't think that it's a proper Question to ask ..
That is because no one can answer this.
(05-24-2013, 11:00 PM)Keepalive Wrote: * Why did he even feel the need to create our world in the first place
He says that he Created us to adoring him , and to give us the opportunity to enter heaven..
That makes us sound like toys and not living beings.
(05-24-2013, 11:00 PM)Keepalive Wrote: * If he created everything around us, you can't deny that he even created the evil around us
Yes,For Sure ,He did.. and that As obstacle 4 the Test..
He would not need to test us unless the did not have faith in his own ability which made us.
(05-24-2013, 11:00 PM)Keepalive Wrote: *If God has no equal, why are we, who are his creation, full of defects? Doesn't this fact question our creator's perfection.
He meant to do that..and he will remove those defects in Heaven..
So why create them in first place and send them to earth?
(05-24-2013, 11:00 PM)Keepalive Wrote: *Why did the best and the most perfect thing created by God betray him eventually and land up being the one we know as devil? What went wrong when God was making him? Why does he even exist? etc.
He was the best gin not an angel ,but because he was so good he got the angels Rank..When god told him to obeisance he Choose to disobey God Cause he says that he is better from us (he made from fire and we made from dust).. and it's not out of God Plan..
If it was so much a part of God's plan, it makes God look like a bad person.
Many people who are innocent suffer in this world. Okay, so you may say that it is because they have sinned in life. But people die here even before they are born. Now tell me what sins they had committed?
Wasn't it God's plan to remove evil from our world long ago? Why is it that it is still exists? Failure of God's plan? Or was it that he loved sin in this world a bit too much to just let it vanish with the devil?
(05-24-2013, 11:00 PM)Keepalive Wrote: *If we believe in stories told to us, we will never get anywhere
if you think it's Just a stories..
Has anyone Saw this Link? http://www.miraclesofthequran.com/scientific_index.html .. And Please if you decided to Have a look ,Make it Deep.
I did have a look at the link you sent. I guess I looked into it more deeply than you'd have wanted me to. None of them are conclusive. More than half are mere speculations. Few of them seem to be a fact that was actually told, but most of them have been forced to interpret in a manner which suits the need of the person who created the website.
I'll site few examples below from that website itself
Quote:No indeed! Rather what they have earned has rusted up their hearts. (Surat al-Mutaffifin, 14)
Quote:The term ‘rusted’ used to describe hearts in verse of Surat al-Mutaffifin may be a reference to biochemical reaction that takes place in the heart. Rust is the result of iron reacting with oxygen – oxidation. The oxygen we absorb from the air is carried through the body thanks to the iron in the hemoglobin in the blood. During this process, the oxygen reacts with the iron in the blood. This means there is a constant process resembling rusting in the blood in the human body, and therefore in the heart, the center of the circulation system.This is just a wild guess on the author's part. The words "may be", and lack of deeper scientific knowledge on his part leads me to think so.
Quote:Remember Our servant Ayyub when he called on his Lord: "Satan has afflicted me with exhaustion and suffering." "Stamp your foot! Here is a cool bath and water to drink." (Qur'an, 38:41-42)
Quote:One of the pieces of advice given to the Prophet Ayyub (as) by Allah in the face of the exhaustion and suffering inflicted by Satan is "stamping the foot." This expression in the verse may be indicating the benefits of movement or sport.Again that word "may be" creeps into the first sentence. Remaining part of the article just tells that movement of body, blood flow, etc., is good for health which is not related to the text they quote above in any way.
Quote:“You will see the mountains you reckoned to be solid going past like clouds – the handwork of Allah Who gives to everything its solidity. He is aware of what you do.” (Surat an-Naml, 88)
Quote:The above verse may be a reference to the strength of the atom, the building block of all matter, and to the orbit of the electrons in the atom. Looked at in the context of atoms, Allah’s use of the term “to everything its solidity” can be interpreted as referring to the solidity of the atom, which cannot be broken even if struck with a sledgehammer (Allah knows the truth). That is because objects themselves are not perfectly solid, only the atom is.As far fetched as it seems (i.e. the explanation of the quote), even the scientific facts given and far from correct. Atom does break down into smaller pieces. And it is not solid. In fact, it is far from solid.
Quote:He Who created the seven heavens in layers. You will not find any discrepancy in the creation of the All-Merciful. Look again-do you see any gaps? Then look again and again. Your sight will return to you dazzled and exhausted! (Qur'an, 67:3-4)
Quote:The billions of stars and galaxies in the universe move in perfect equilibrium in the paths set out for them. Stars, planets and satellites rotate not only around their own axes but also together with the systems of which they are an integral part. Sometimes, galaxies containing 200-300 billion stars move across each others' paths. Yet amazingly, no collisions take place that might damage the great order in the universe. This miracle is something over which all of us should reflect.Their is no perfect equilibrium in and nebula or galaxy or star or even solar system for instance. Amazingly, collision does take place. You just don't see it as often as you find car accidents on earth. How do you think the asteroids came into existence?
Quote:Do they not see the birds suspended in mid-air up in the sky? Nothing holds them there except Allah. There are certainly signs in that for people who believe. (Surat an-Nahl, 79)
Quote:Due to the force of gravity, all bodies left in the air will eventually fall to earth, either fast or slowly. Everything, living or otherwise, is subject to gravity. But as a miracle of Allah (God) birds are able to resist this force and fly upward and downward in the air. They maneuver in the air, and sometimes even fold their wings and glide through it. All details in birds, from their feathers to their lungs, from the arrangement of their feathers to the shape of their wings, are equipped with a special feature and order intended to enable them to fly. A chick totally unaware of the act of flight and the laws of aerodynamics is born with the ability to fly. The chick launches itself downwards and begins to fly, just as if it knew its body was created for flight. This is not information that is taught subsequently or that a bird learns by trial and error. The way a bird knows it has the body structure needed to fly, finds the courage to launch itself into the air and then flies without hitting the ground all happens through Allah’s inspiration.Certainly, the interpretation of the quote is no where near the quote from the book. The author claimed in the title that modern science of aerodynamic forces would be found in what the quote said. I was disillusioned once more.
I just said what I believe in. I have a habit (maybe good/bad) of questioning everything presented to me. I wont just believe in anything because everyone does. It is mere curiosity to know the real thing and not just accept something out of fear.
Cheers
RE: Life - Keepalive - 05-25-2013
[/quote]
I just said what I believe in. I have a habit (maybe good/bad) of questioning everything presented to me. I wont just believe in anything because everyone does. It is mere curiosity to know the real thing and not just accept something out of fear.
Cheers
[/quote]
Im just like you..
And that's Why I'm not Sure about anything untill now..
but im saying -
* if there was a god and life after this , we will enter Hell because we didn't have faith
*if there wasn't and we were having faith ,WHAT WE WILL Lose?( if you Know,what is asked from you you will be surprised..for start ,just admit in god and his profit and at last you Will enter Heaven.)
and believing in god is a "FAITH" not a Math equation ,so you will not be always full satisfy in the answer's( I would give you more answer's if you like,but i don't have Time right now)
I wish you the BEST.
RE: Life - Solixious - 05-25-2013
(05-25-2013, 11:00 AM)Keepalive Wrote:Quote:I just said what I believe in. I have a habit (maybe good/bad) of questioning everything presented to me. I wont just believe in anything because everyone does. It is mere curiosity to know the real thing and not just accept something out of fear.
Cheers
Im just like you..
And that's Why I'm not Sure about anything till now..
but im saying -
* if there was a god and life after this , we will enter Hell because we didn't have faith
*if there wasn't and we were having faith ,WHAT WE WILL Lose?( if you Know,what is asked from you you will be surprised..for start ,just admit in god and his profit and at last you Will enter Heaven.)
and believing in god is a "FAITH" not a Math equation ,so you will not be always full satisfy in the answer's( I would give you more answer's if you like,but i don't have Time right now)
I wish you the BEST.
I respect your faith, but it is different for me. I would rather live my life righteously without worrying about consequence instead of believing in something uncertain because I fear I might lose something in the end.
Cheers
RE: Life - FunKx - 05-25-2013
The only theory I could ever believe - There was a huge "Boom" in the uneverse (probably meteorites collision) so that's how planets are now planets and asteroids/meteorites are everywhere...blah. blah. blah. Everything else is pure evolution, physics and chemical reactions. Believing in some "God" is the stupidest thing a man can ever do. You see, we often don't believe simple people telling us simple things. God is something far from simple lie. Still, why do people believe in such a huge lie (A man who created the universe and noone's ever seen him) Except for the crazy lieing motherfckers who claim that they've seen God. The've seen no shit :epic:
As for, how did a thing create from nothing, I'd say...physics + chemic. There may have been other chemical elements that caused everything to happen and these elements may no more exist. (we don't know that) Maybe nothing was able to make something
Think of it that way.
As for human life purpose...there is none. I bet cats don't wonder why they live, they just live. We, human are more intelligent, so we can decide, life or death + we think about lame shit. But like @王子様Xero said...death is nothingness. When you die, you die.
I personally was never afraid of death.
And if God created everything, then where did he come from?