[Defeat]

I understand that desperate people can do desperate things. No matter the circumstance, stealing is immoral/illegal. The same goes for any sort of warranty fraud.

My justification for SE'ing and refunding is that it's usually too huge companies who can afford the loss and the company may have done something even worse. But carding is targeting individuals, and you could fuck their life up by carding.

Individuals work at the companies you're hurting. When the company loses out on its bottom line, guess whose wages get cut? You're hurting someone else, for personal gain.

Completely agree. In many cases, if a company loses out on profits, that means cuts, as Oni says. They don't just sit there and think "oh the insurance will cover it". Also, remember, you may be one person stealing that one thing from amazon, but that doesn't mean there aren't another 20,000 people trying to do the same thing. It adds up.

Would you go into a local store and take items? Assuming it won't hurt anyone?

Carding and SEing are on a similar level to me.

I agree. In fact, I may even to as far as saying you'd be better off carding if one has to put some sort of morals and values to it. Banks make so much money on pure profit that that can cover fraudulent activity on a large scale as oppose to most running companies these days. A small or medium size business can go under after so many cases, but I doubt an established bank would ever do so. Here in Canada I've been a victim of carding twice and the banks were more than happy to assist me and investigate. I don't think it affected their mass profits one bit. There's really no legitimate justification for either side, but just to throw my two cents.

[mothered]

Here in Canada I've been a victim of carding twice and the banks were more than happy to assist me and investigate.  

As a matter of Interest, once they realized It was an act of fraudulent activity, did they actually replenish the funds and then proceed with their Investigation?

In my locality, that's how all major banks operate, of which I commend their policies In doing so.

[Jiggly]

I understand that desperate people can do desperate things. No matter the circumstance, stealing is immoral/illegal. The same goes for any sort of warranty fraud.


Individuals work at the companies you're hurting. When the company loses out on its bottom line, guess whose wages get cut? You're hurting someone else, for personal gain.

Completely agree. In many cases, if a company loses out on profits, that means cuts, as Oni says. They don't just sit there and think "oh the insurance will cover it". Also, remember, you may be one person stealing that one thing from amazon, but that doesn't mean there aren't another 20,000 people trying to do the same thing. It adds up.

Would you go into a local store and take items? Assuming it won't hurt anyone?

Carding and SEing are on a similar level to me.

I agree. In fact, I may even to as far as saying you'd be better off carding if one has to put some sort of morals and values to it. Banks make so much money on pure profit that that can cover fraudulent activity on a large scale as oppose to most running companies these days. A small or medium size business can go under after so many cases, but I doubt an established bank would ever do so. Here in Canada I've been a victim of carding twice and the banks were more than happy to assist me and investigate. I don't think it affected their mass profits one bit. There's really no legitimate justification for either side, but just to throw my two cents.

I have a colleague who experienced card fraud just recently. Of course, she will get all funds back. But, her main issue is that it's 2 weeks until payday and she has to wait to get those funds back.

[Jiggly]

Carding is like taking from an individual persons bank account. They may need the money to pay for diapers, food or something. As with a company the worst situation is they could be bankrupt and the people having their wallets intact still. Also why you bankrupt a company and start another one, instead of bankrupting yourself.

Imagine you're working for a company that goes bankrupt... A lot more than just the company is affected. All the people working for it are impacted when something drastic happens.

Moreover, the company's clients who solely rely on their business, are also affected.

They too, may face significant financial loss and/or bankruptcy.

Good point. Service partners can be included too.

[mothered]

Completely agree. In many cases, if a company loses out on profits, that means cuts, as Oni says. They don't just sit there and think "oh the insurance will cover it". Also, remember, you may be one person stealing that one thing from amazon, but that doesn't mean there aren't another 20,000 people trying to do the same thing. It adds up.

Would you go into a local store and take items? Assuming it won't hurt anyone?

Carding and SEing are on a similar level to me.

I agree.  In fact, I may even to as far as saying you'd be better off carding if one has to put some sort of morals and values to it.  Banks make so much money on pure profit that that can cover fraudulent activity on a large scale as oppose to most running companies these days.  A small or medium size business can go under after so many cases, but I doubt an established bank would ever do so.  Here in Canada I've been a victim of carding twice and the banks were more than happy to assist me and investigate.  I don't think it affected their mass profits one bit.  There's really no legitimate justification for either side, but just to throw my two cents.

I have a colleague who experienced card fraud just recently. Of course, she will get all funds back. But, her main issue is that it's 2 weeks until payday and she has to wait to get those funds back.

I assume her financial Institution will reimburse her loss, and then proceed with the Investigation to reclaim the funds on their end?

In my locality, all major banks operate In this fashion. But as you've mentioned, It's the waiting period (and the running around) to receive the funds Into the account that can have an Impact on personal commitments.

[chesterbeatdeath]

Stealing is really only okay in my book if you can gain SQL DB access and spoof a fake card into their midst without raising suspicion, and then using the veracity you created around that fake card in their databases to fool them into thinking you paid them. And it should only be done to company's so large that this sort of attack would never slip by. So, uh... Basically don't steal.
If you have to, I'll admit there's nothing wrong with stealing to survive: Food, clothing, shelter, and of course drugs!!!
But online theft is difficult and we all have better things to do. You don't? Shit. I feel bad for you, imaginary antagonizer.

[mothered]

If you have to, I'll admit there's nothing wrong with stealing to survive: Food, clothing, shelter

I don't condone stealing In It's entirely, but for reasons mentioned above, It's debatable depending from whom and their circumstances.

They may also have similar needs.

[chesterbeatdeath]

If you have to, I'll admit there's nothing wrong with stealing to survive: Food, clothing, shelter

I don't condone stealing In It's entirely, but for reasons mentioned above, It's debatable depending from whom and their circumstances.

They may also have similar needs.

You forgot drugs. Drugs are very, very important. I don't know about you, but in my line of business, it's important to be happy.

QuickEdit: I'm a pothead, not a junkie. Anyone who has to steal from others to get stoned isn't getting stoned correctly in any sense of the word ever pondered.

[mothered]

If you have to, I'll admit there's nothing wrong with stealing to survive: Food, clothing, shelter

I don't condone stealing In It's entirely, but for reasons mentioned above, It's debatable depending from whom and their circumstances.

They may also have similar needs.

You forgot drugs. Drugs are very, very important. I don't know about you, but in my line of business, it's important to be happy.

I noticed that but decided to leave It out of the equation.

Provided It's taken In a controlled state and that's what generates your happiness, then all the better for you.

[chesterbeatdeath]

I don't condone stealing In It's entirely, but for reasons mentioned above, It's debatable depending from whom and their circumstances.

They may also have similar needs.

You forgot drugs. Drugs are very, very important. I don't know about you, but in my line of business, it's important to be happy.

I noticed that but decided to leave It out of the equation.

Provided It's taken In a controlled state and that's what generates your happiness, then all the better for you.

Requiring weed money pulled me further into the PC world. In order to afford Friday's dime in 8th grade I allegedly started selling pirated games, movies, and CDs. Back when hand-to-hand software piracy was still a thing people did.