[Bish0pQ]

Hello everyone,

Often when I see everyone posting screenshots/recordings of their IDE, I see it's usually Visual Studio.
There's nothing wrong with Visual Studio, I've used it for a long time as well, but recently I have changed to Jetbrains Rider.

It's not free, but I've been using a lot more of the Jetbrains tools lately like Rider and datagrip.
I first used Resharper for Visual Studio for a while but it just felt so slow.

Anyone else that is using or considered Rider here?

[phyrrus9]

Had a quick look, and I am very unimpressed. It appears to be just another version of Eclipse with some plugins and a theme, but they charge you over $100 PER YEAR.

I use VS a lot on my Windows dev machine (the least used). Everywhere else I still use Vi.

[Bish0pQ]

Had a quick look, and I am very unimpressed. It appears to be just another version of Eclipse with some plugins and a theme, but they charge you over $100 PER YEAR.

I use VS a lot on my Windows dev machine (the least used). Everywhere else I still use Vi.

Can't blame you, I had the same thing when I had the first look at it. I mean, it's not for everyone, that's for sure.
It's far more than just theming, even though the theming already looks nicer than the one from VS in my opinion.

Are you familiar with Resharper for VS? It does a lot for you and gives info about possible bugs, helps shorten methods, clean-up and way more.
For me personally, it's nice because all of their products are perfectly integrated into each other. Syntax highlighting and suggestions for queries that you write are for example not possible out-of-the box for VS. For Rider it's all right from their Datagrip program built into Rider.

Also unless you are using the community version of VS, VS is actually more expensive than all rider products together.
Great to hear you still use VI, have been wanting to learn it for quite a while now.

PS: Rider has VIM support through a plug-in: https://plugins.jetbrains.com/plugin/164-ideavim

[phyrrus9]

Had a quick look, and I am very unimpressed. It appears to be just another version of Eclipse with some plugins and a theme, but they charge you over $100 PER YEAR.

I use VS a lot on my Windows dev machine (the least used). Everywhere else I still use Vi.

Can't blame you, I had the same thing when I had the first look at it. I mean, it's not for everyone, that's for sure.
It's far more than just theming, even though the theming already looks nicer than the one from VS in my opinion.

Are you familiar with Resharper for VS? It does a lot for you and gives info about possible bugs, helps shorten methods, clean-up and way more.
For me personally, it's nice because all of their products are perfectly integrated into each other. Syntax highlighting and suggestions for queries that you write are for example not possible out-of-the box for VS. For Rider it's all right from their Datagrip program built into Rider.

Also unless you are using the community version of VS, VS is actually more expensive than all rider products together.
Great to hear you still use VI, have been wanting to learn it for quite a while now.

I don't like the concept of paying for development tools, especially plugins. I have many years under my belt writing bad code, getting fucked because of it, and learning how to write better code (go look at some of my pre-2010 code and you'll see what I mean). I do sometimes use tools to double check, but those are mostly to take better advantage of new language features in old code.

[Bish0pQ]

Had a quick look, and I am very unimpressed. It appears to be just another version of Eclipse with some plugins and a theme, but they charge you over $100 PER YEAR.

I use VS a lot on my Windows dev machine (the least used). Everywhere else I still use Vi.

Can't blame you, I had the same thing when I had the first look at it. I mean, it's not for everyone, that's for sure.
It's far more than just theming, even though the theming already looks nicer than the one from VS in my opinion.

Are you familiar with Resharper for VS? It does a lot for you and gives info about possible bugs, helps shorten methods, clean-up and way more.
For me personally, it's nice because all of their products are perfectly integrated into each other. Syntax highlighting and suggestions for queries that you write are for example not possible out-of-the box for VS. For Rider it's all right from their Datagrip program built into Rider.

Also unless you are using the community version of VS, VS is actually more expensive than all rider products together.
Great to hear you still use VI, have been wanting to learn it for quite a while now.

I don't like the concept of paying for development tools, especially plugins. I have many years under my belt writing bad code, getting fucked because of it, and learning how to write better code (go look at some of my pre-2010 code and you'll see what I mean). I do sometimes use tools to double check, but those are mostly to take better advantage of new language features in old code.

I respect your opinion but I do not agree fully. If a tool helps me getting the job done in a quicker way, while helping me avoid errors, I think that's worth to pay for.
You have a good point in learning how to write good code by falling and standing back up and I definitly agree. The faster navigation, less crashes of VS and help made me want to switch. I have had numerous times that VS handled something wrong or there is an issue where you need to delete the ".vs" folder to fix it. I was just getting tired of it.

Also, let's say for example you encounter a NullReferenceException. You know what it is and you know how to prevent it, but for some reason because you committed too soon or you didn't see the ?? you missed to check for null. Rider/Resharped helps you see that. Even though you know what you should've done to avoid it, you now SEE the error and can solve it before it goes to QA or production.

But I totally agree with you that you shouldn't let tools do all the work.

[phyrrus9]

Also, let's say for example you encounter a NullReferenceException. You know what it is and you know how to prevent it, but for some reason because you committed too soon or you didn't see the ?? you missed to check for null. Rider/Resharped helps you see that. Even though you know what you should've done to avoid it, you now SEE the error and can solve it before it goes to QA or production.

But I totally agree with you that you shouldn't let tools do all the work.

These things rarely happen for me. I always work on small units of code at a time (I yell at people for 500-line commits), and I always (90% of the time) test my code before I push it. When it's something that needs to be tested on device or somewhere that it needs to transit through git first, I set up a branch for it and merge it if and only if it works as intended. So in that case, I'd see the exception (assuming it was part of the normal use case) before I was even finished writing the unit.

That being said, for some people, those tools help. For me, they just slow me down as I've constantly got things popping up and cluttering my screen. I type too quickly to ever make use of them, and in many instances I even hate the autocomplete dialog box coming up (I almost never use that either, unless I'm repeating something a bunch, then I'll select it the first time and just tab it before the box appears for the remaining ones).

If I were working in a language or environment that I don't have that level of skill in (say Ruby or Python), I'd probably make use of features like that, but for C#, C, Objective-C, etc I'd much prefer to just be left alone with my keyboard and eyes. I believe XCode used to have a feature that allowed you to disable all of those features unless you hit the tab key. Generally the only time I use that kind of stuff is when I'm going through a code audit, and in VS I'm just looking at the "Information" section and likely selecting the best recommendation (which is usually just code clarity updates)